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I'm Down
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Posted - 2012.09.13 20:04:00 -
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In exactly what way is a 512 dps Belicose with 0 disrupting effects a disruption cruiser?
It now does around 50 more dps than a 5% per level maller would do based on those proposed changes. When does thinking ever come in to the picture at CCP? |
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Posted - 2012.09.13 20:41:00 -
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still waiting to hear how the belicose proposal makes sense. |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 00:46:00 -
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4 dev replies and 0 answers later, still waiting to hear how the pure DPS Belicose is somehow a disruptor cruiser that out dps's both Amarr Cruisers maxed out on dps even if the Maller gets a 5% damage bonus
Exactly what about painters disrupts anything? |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 01:22:00 -
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Sigras wrote:Gypsio III wrote:So with the inevitable offgrid mindlinked link T3, a rigged Arbitrator will have TDs that each have -92.25% to optimal or tracking? Wow. (hope those numbers are right  ) i get -83.665% Im not sure where you're getting your numbers . . . are you adding the T3 bonus instead of multiplying it?
it's actually 93.28 with rigs, and a proteus. |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 01:24:00 -
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Vladimir Norkoff wrote:I'm Down wrote:4 dev replies and 0 answers later, still waiting to hear how the pure DPS Belicose is somehow a disruptor cruiser that out dps's both Amarr Cruisers maxed out on dps even if the Maller gets a 5% damage bonus Both Amarr cruisers? Last I checked there were like 4. And the new DPS Belli looks like it will do about 350-ish dps (~200 HAM / 150 drones). Which is about the same (or possibly even less) than the new Arbi. As for the Maller, I was under the impression that it too will be changed. Upgraded rather significantly from what was implied in the DevBlog. Or perhaps you know something we don't? Or we could all just jump on the rage wagon too! I'm Down wrote:Exactly what about painters disrupts anything? Your opponent's ship blowing up tends to disrupt them slightly. Using Painters on them can help facilitate their ship blowing up.
check your facts, it will do 552 dps maxed out before overload or implants are even considered. |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 02:08:00 -
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Alara IonStorm wrote:I'm Down wrote:
check your facts, it will do 552 dps maxed out before overload or implants are even considered.
Show your work.
352 HAMs
190 Drones
542... excuse me, i was 10 off.
You can eft an osprey navy to see the missile damage, and the 4th low would go to a drone damage mod. Still leaves room for an MWD and a LSE in the mids, and the usual other items.
and oh yeah, unlike most other ships, it's not tied to damage types.... |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 02:16:00 -
[7] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:I'm Down wrote:
Exactly what about painters disrupts anything?
Disruption is a poor word fot this ship line, E-War is better. Target painters are a hostile module that increases the signature radius of a ship. With an increased signature raidus a ship becomes much eaiser to Target/Lock. that makes it a e-war module
No, i think disruptor is a prime choice... but even ewar isn't met.
Arbitrator... disrupt gun ships offensive abilities range/tracking (a defensive mechanic)
Blackbird... disrupts a ships locking abilities (a defensive mechanic)
Celestis.... disrups a ships target range or lock time (a defensive mechanic)
Belicose... increases a targets incoming damage (an offensive mechanic)
notice a disparity there?
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Posted - 2012.09.14 02:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:
Can we please discuss real fits? That is over on both CPU and grid, and even if it fit would be a **** fit.
-Liang
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Drone damage Amplifier I
Experimental 10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
EM Ward Field II
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
[empty med slot]
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Assault Missile
Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
with 22 cpu left for the last mid slot.... easily fit another painter or several other options.
If you really want to toss out 40 dps, you can lose the drone damage amp and still be over 500 dps, and get your precious DCU.
Learn how to fit. |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 02:29:00 -
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Liang Nuren wrote:
Jesus can you learn how to fit a ******* ship? Do you even PVP?
-Liang
I'm sorry, lets see a real fit pro? I know that this fit gets around 20-30,000 ehp for small fleet combat and who honestly gives a **** about sig ratio on a throw away dps ship. You will only find 3 other cruiser under current game mechanics that can even compete dps wise to this "disruption" cruiser.
Alara IonStorm wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:
Jesus can you learn how to fit a ******* ship? Do you even PVP?
-Liang
It is this. [empty med slot] That makes it art.
hey dip ****, did you see the part where i left it open intentionally and told you teh remaining CPU so that you could fit in a variety of options? Or are you one of those ******* retards who needs me to spell this out 100% for you? |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 02:51:00 -
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Vladimir Norkoff wrote:I'm Down wrote: I know that this fit gets around 20-30,000 ehp for small fleet combat... Because including leadership/link bonuses in your base stats is always a good idea....?  Let's be honest, your fit has 19K ehp (with Liang's DCU). It is made of glass. And overlooking the lack of a point, it does have some niche uses. But for general use it is horribly terribad.
B/C when it explicitly states "small gang combat" you naturally move away from bonuses huh?
I really wish you guys would quit trying to judge ships by their unbonused, un buffed neutered to hell fits and realize that your terribad style of gameplay is not how this game get's balanced properly. |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 19:24:00 -
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I'm sorry, but if you think it's a Paper thin setup on a Belicose because the 4 lows were dedicated to dps, you don't get the point. You can still get this thing upwards of 40,000-50,000 ehp with a bonus ship and still around 500 dps.
I mean do I literally have to theory craft every fit for you just to show you the variety of ways that this is not a good idea?
It's just as troubling to me as the fact that you're giving the Arbitrator a 93.28% possible TD effect where 1 TD can basically completely shut down any ship it get's put on with no possibility of failure at crazy long ranges of effect no less.
I mean, does it make sense that a 250km range rokh can be brought down to 17km optimal by 1 module on one ship from 130+ km away? |
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Posted - 2012.09.14 21:06:00 -
[12] - Quote
Heribeck Weathers wrote:I'm Down wrote:Blah balh if i fit all my slots with PG mods and rigs i can fit a decent tank
Well imagin that it has slots to fit PG mods so you can fit bigger mods, how about that guys, OP as heck Hay if you fit 180s on a cain you can fit TWO 1600 plates, where doooomed! Or maybe we would like to have slots to nano fit it and enough grid to NOT waist on fitting mods all over the place. Also TDs are OP as they are right now, the gang i fly with taks 4 every where and they make cains into jokes but at least he has his drones and newts and such, unlike ECM so its not as OP to the tear eyes out degree
Obviously you didn't grasp the point where Fozzie argued that the ship is paper thin in order to get dps, and I countered by saying, hell no, it's high dps and tank if fit a certain way. But who needs to actually decode the hard language of English? |
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Posted - 2012.09.15 02:58:00 -
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CCP " we don't want ships to fall into holes because of stupid teirs"
CCP "Certain ships must always have equal total slot counts"
CCP "drones are balance ok"
While they might only be synopsis in reality, these ideas are why the Devs suck at their jobs.
Saying that ships must have the same total slot count is so restrictive in balance and uniqueness that it's totally defeating your attempt to revamp all of these ships. Destroyers are the most noticable debacle, but these ships are just another notch on the bed post for the latest screw. Drones bays galore. Ship fittings that make no sense. Not understanding the problems of oversized fits. Not understanding the tracking problems in game. Further unbalancing things that are already powerful. Not nerfing things that are stupid powerful.
Go enjoy the props from average players who will sing your praises b/c they can't think past the hype, but this is exactly why player retainment is so far on the decline. |
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